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 Post subject: Should Northern Historians ....
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:18 pm 
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Location: USA
Refer to Lee's forays into Pennsylvainia as 'invasions'?

Since the North never acknowledged the CSA as an independent country Lee's armies merely moved about within the USA, right? Technically speaking from the Northern viewpoint, the entire war was fought on the soil (not naval actions of course) of the United States of America, correct?

Any thoughts?

al


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 4:54 pm 
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Hi, Al,

Sounds like a topic for the lawyers. If after the Declaration of Independence,the colonies had lost, would they ever have been independent? I have read that there was some significance to Lincoln declaring a blockade, and that the US government was unable to exercise the functions of government in various portions of the South for four years and more. Also, some radical republicans wanted to treat the southern states as conquered provinces, indicating to me a de facto recognition that they were independent of the US for some period of time. I'd say fire off that question to the Supreme Court and see how they respond.

MG Mike Mihalik
1/III/AoMiss/CSA


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 5:10 pm 
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invasion

n.

1. The act of invading, especially the entrance of an armed force into a territory to conquer.
2. A large-scale onset of something injurious or harmful, such as a disease.
3. An intrusion or encroachment.

incursion

n.

1. An aggressive entrance into foreign territory; a raid or invasion.
2. The act of entering another's territory or domain.
3. The act of entering or running into: homes damaged by the incursion of floodwater.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 2:09 am 
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Since the US government refers to the war as a "Rebellion", invasion certainly is a misnomer. Lee was merely moving the rebellion into Pennsylvania.

BG Drex Ringbloom,
Cdr,2nd Div,VIII Corp
Army of the Shenandoah


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 3:32 am 
Lee's foray into Pennsylvania (or Bragg's into Kentucky, Ewell's into Maryland, etc.) can only be considered invasions if all Union advances into Southern territory are also properly termed as invasions.

Regards,

Lt. Gen. Alan Lynn
CSA Chief of Staff
3rd Bgde, 3rd Cav Div, II Corps, AoA

God Bless <><


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 3:52 am 
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Lee was just going on a sight seeing tour of the North. He just happened to bring a few friends along. I don't know why they got so upset.

Actually I am not sure the legal standing of the Civil War was ever established. The Radical Republicans quickly dropped any attempts to prosecute Southern leaders after the war which would have been the case if it wasn't a war. They were very much afraid that any trial might lead to a review before the Supreme Court which might rule that the South did have the right to succeed and undo the entire thing.

LG. Kennon Whitehead
Chatham Grays
1/1/III AoM (CSA)


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:51 am 
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As I recall(I may be wrong) after the Radical Republicans took over the reconstruction process, weren't the Confederate States placed under military rule, and then once they'd agreed to new constitutions that were acceptable to Congress, weren't those States then "readmitted" to the Union.

If that was the case then to be "readmitted" must mean that they had left in the firstplace.

Lt General Malcolm Hunt
2nd Bde
Granite Infantry Div.
III Corps
AoG
CSA


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:28 am 
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Bill Peters</i>
<br />If a mail carrier comes into your front yard and you own a dog is that an invasion .... or a case of temporary insanity?[:D]

Col. Bill Peters, The Boise Rifles, II Corps Artillery, AoA
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

You have mail carriers that actually come anywhere near your door[?]

LG. Kennon Whitehead
Chatham Grays
1/1/III AoM (CSA)


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:39 am 
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by KWhitehead</i>
the South did have the right to succeed
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

[:D]

Gen. Walter, USA
<i>The Blue Blitz</i>
3/2/VIII AoS
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:42 am 
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">As I recall(I may be wrong) after the Radical Republicans took over the reconstruction process, weren't the Confederate States placed under military rule, and then once they'd agreed to new constitutions that were acceptable to Congress, weren't those States then "readmitted" to the Union.
If that was the case then to be "readmitted" must mean that they had left in the first place. -Lt General Malcolm Hunt <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Absolutely! "Readmitted" is an admission that the South had left, but understanding the English/American language has always been a Yankee handicap. [:D]
... Also, realizing that a new thought is contradictory to a previous rule already voted on and accepted as law. [:D]
It can be difficult to consistently maintain a line of thought that includes several ideas. [:o)] [;)]
While proclaiming that secession is prohibited, the North also let West Virginia secede from Virginia and stay separate. That also is consistent with Abe Lincoln's earlier position that:
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">“Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable, a most sacred right—a right which we hope and believe is to liberate the world. Nor is this right confined to cases in which the whole people of an existing government may choose to exercise it. Any portion of such people, that can, may revolutionize, and make their own of so much of the territory as they inhabit.â€


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 11:44 pm 
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As an army of "Non-Pennsylvanians" it could still be construed an invasion, as they definitely weren't invited.

1st LT Stephen Trauth
XVI Corps 1st Division 6th Brigade (divisional artillery)
AoT


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