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 Post subject: Sealing The Deal
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:15 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2002 9:00 am
Posts: 154
Location: USA
It was my opinion that free and open debate are not to be discouraged. I still believe that. Further, that new and fresh ideas not be suppressed. All are free to express themselves without being subjected to ad hominem attacks from others. This is not a 'Smoking Room' type of post as it is relevant to the ongoing debate on muster and forum conduct.

In the spirit of full and free disclosure which is, after all, the bedrock of a free society I feel compelled to post a link to this thread on the subject, from another club forum.

http://www.wargame.ch/board/acw/topic.a ... C_ID=13715

It was not my intent to take sides in this debate. But in accordance with my desire to not alienate new and junior members of the club, present and future, I feel this must be presented. This kind of conduct must stop. I say this knowing full well that I may face consequences in this and another club. Although I cannot see any justification for being punished for presenting the facts.

The second part of my sig line from William Lloyd Garrison is not just meant to convey rhetorical flourish, as it were. It's how I live my life. Maybe that's why I'm not so popular with the higher ups at work.

So be it.



CE Trog
CPT, USA
6th Artillery Bde
III Div/XVI Corps
Army of the Tennessee

E-Mail cetrog@comcast.net

"My aim was to whip the rebels. To humble their pride. To follow them to their innermost recesses and to make them fear and dread us. War is cruelty! There is no use in trying to reform it. The crueler it is the sooner it will be over."

-<i>William Tecumseh Sherman</i>-

"I will be as harsh as truth, and uncompromising as justice... I am in earnest, I will not equivocate, I will not excuse, I will not retreat a single inch, and I will be heard."

- <i>William Lloyd Garrison</i> -


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:43 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 22, 2001 4:51 pm
Posts: 2804
Location: Massachusetts, USA
It is my opinion that you should read this post:

http://www.wargame.ch/board/acw/topic.a ... C_ID=13722

Further, there is no intention to discourage discussions, but the type of comments in your reference was no longer a relevant discussion on the topic and had devolved to personal attacks.

These type of personal attacks will not be tolerated.

You should be aware that the topic was LOCKED NOT DELETED.

Nothing was suppressed, the topic was locked.

I think your comments were well intentioned, but in light of the subsequent topic noted above, were not necessary.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I say this knowing full well that I may face consequences in this and another club. Although I cannot see any justification for being punished for presenting the facts.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

What consequences would you expect from expressing your opinion? There are not any that I know of.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, Commanding, Army of Ohio
Image
ACWGC Cabinet Member
ACWGC Records Site Administrator
</b></font id="gold">


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:56 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2002 9:00 am
Posts: 154
Location: USA
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Ernie Sands</i>
<br />It is my opinion that you should read this post:

http://www.wargame.ch/board/acw/topic.a ... C_ID=13722

Further, there is no intention to discourage discussions, but the type of comments in your reference was no longer a relevant discussion on the topic and had devolved to personal attacks.

These type of personal attacks will not be tolerated.

You should be aware that the topic was LOCKED NOT DELETED.

Nothing was suppressed, the topic was locked.

I think your comments were well intentioned, but in light of the subsequent topic noted above, were not necessary.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I say this knowing full well that I may face consequences in this and another club. Although I cannot see any justification for being punished for presenting the facts.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

What consequences would you expect from expressing your opinion? There are not any that I know of.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, Commanding, Army of Ohio
Image
ACWGC Cabinet Member
ACWGC Records Site Administrator
</b></font id="gold">

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

With all due respect sir, I have two important points to make, here.

First. Check the the times the posts were made. Mine was made at 10:15 PM forum time. The other post by Gen Laub was made at 10:54 PM. In the interim my post was viewed approximately a dozen times. It could, therefore, be construed as a reaction to my posting. Draw what conclusions you may.


Second. Whether you lock a thread or delete it. You suppress debate on that thread. Also, when subsequent threads/posts are made referencing the locked thread are dismissed as 'name calling' and 'not approprite for this forum' (paraphrasing here), that IS suppressing debate.

As for the consequences I mentioned, I felt there might be sanctions for what I did in posting that link to a thread not generally viewed by most members of the club. Although I felt that idea rather inconsequential. The other club I alluded to in my possible receipt of sanction is not this one and has been discussed with General Laub in a private e-mail. I give Gen Laub my full permission to share that e-mail with any who may ask to see it. I will not post it publicly for reasons that will be evident when you read it. If you like, I will forward it to any who wish to see it.

If anyone has any questions as to my reasoning or motive for what I have posted I have NO problem discussing it.

CE Trog
CPT, USA
6th Artillery Bde
III Div/XVI Corps
Army of the Tennessee

E-Mail cetrog@comcast.net

"My aim was to whip the rebels. To humble their pride. To follow them to their innermost recesses and to make them fear and dread us. War is cruelty! There is no use in trying to reform it. The crueler it is the sooner it will be over."

-<i>William Tecumseh Sherman</i>-

"I will be as harsh as truth, and uncompromising as justice... I am in earnest, I will not equivocate, I will not excuse, I will not retreat a single inch, and I will be heard."

- <i>William Lloyd Garrison</i> -


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