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 Post subject: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:04 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:48 am
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Location: Las Cruces, NM USA
An interesting article from NY Times how they are recreating digital maps for truer understanding of battlefields.

found here: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/27/arts/geographic-information-systems-help-scholars-see-history.html

BG Elkin
3rd Div/(2nd CAV)/XVIth Corps AotT

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 Post subject: Re: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 8:48 am 
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One of my favorite subjects. But I extend it to include not just what is visible by LOS from some point but what is recognizeable from some location. They are considerably different. At what distance can to recognize the size and composition of a force opposing you? As opposed to just knowing something is out there. Because of the roll of the land, trees, fences, etc. your actual view is rather limited. It is basically an horizon with no depth that varies in distance for a few feet to miles. Recognition of what you are "seeing" is highly dependent on things like viewing angle, weather and other atmospheric effects like smoke, movement, color, shadows, etc.

Viewing Little Round Top from a distances wouldn't tell you whether there was just a signal station there or a Corps just beyond the tree line. Only by sending scouts or skirmishers to the hill could that be determined. And that is why the most significant failure at Gettsyburg was the absence of Stuart who was the man in charge of making sure the ANV knew what was in front of it.

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 Post subject: Re: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:07 am 
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Stuart with the army would have had considerable effect. First, Stuart would have brought the two brigades left in Virginia north rather than forgetting about them. Second, cavalry would have been available to protect the Army trains and communications. This would have freed Pickett of that duty and placed him with the army. Third, Stuart and the Rebel cavalry still was superior to the Union cavalry at the functions of scouting and screening. Fourth, Lee wouldn't have been guessing at what he faced on the first day and would have had the means to coordinate his army against Gettysburg. Fifth, he would have bee informed the Union army had been marched north two or three days sooner which would have allowed him to meet the lead elements of the AoP with his whole army as he intended.

I can't help but think all these positives wouldn't offset the negative of not having the Union cavalry running Stuart into the ground.

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 Post subject: Re: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:43 pm 
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I just got around to reading this. Thanks for posting, General Elkins!

I wonder if this would be useful in upgrading some of the maps.

The concept of seeing what Lee saw is intriguing. I wonder if the games will ever progress to the point where you don't see anything until you access a leader or unit, and then you would only see what they saw. There would still be way more information than was historically available, but it would add to the fog of war, I think, because it would be a lot more difficult to collate than is presently the case. And it would add a whole new level to MP play, if folks would only be able to access the units in their assigned organization.

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 Post subject: Re: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 2:54 pm 
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Leader counters needing to be accessed to remove the fog of war? An absolutely brillant concept that can be added some day to military gaming. It would change turn based war games immensely and make them much more realistic. Could you imagine a Jackson like move literally exploding on your flank. Great idea.

BG Elkin

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 Post subject: Re: What did Lee see on July 2
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:35 am 
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It wouldn't work for two player games since it would just add a lot of work for each player since they would spend a lot of time jumping from one leader to the next. But in MP games it would introduce an interesting bit of Fog of War. Combined with delayed messaging between Generals and things could get interesting.

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