ACWGC Forums

American Civil War Game Club

* ACWGC    * Dpt. of Records (DoR)    *Club Recruiting Office     ACWGC Memorial

* CSA HQ    * VMI   * Join CSA    

* Union HQ   * UMA   * Join Union    

CSA Armies:   ANV   AoT

Union Armies:   AotT    AotC    AotP    AotS     Union Army Forums

Link Express

Club Forums:     NWC    CCC     Home Pages:     NWC    CCC    ACWGC
It is currently Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:45 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 6 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 7:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 10:42 pm
Posts: 220
In a number of games one or more of the enemy's units have not routed to their rear and ended up behind my main line. If they disappear from view they can recover and then emerge and attack supply and artillery from the rear. There are usually only a few but they can cause trouble out of all proportion to their number unless significant resources (sometimes an entire brigade or more) are devoted to hunting them down. In battles where there many wooded hexes it is sometimes still not possible to find and destroy these renegade units.

Although it is well within the game parameters and not in conflict with any Club rule it is certainly not realistic as such units in reality were primarily concerned with returning to their own lines rather than scurrying around and attacking artillery and supply [aided by the benefits provided by a birds-eye view of the battlefield that the game provides].

Has anyone developed a workable house rule to cover this situation?

_________________
Paul Swanson
Major-General
Army of Northern Virginia


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:01 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2021 5:19 pm
Posts: 80
that is a good question and one i have never really thought about and has happened to me, and i have done the same.... hmmmm. Maybe a house rule should be applied but what would it be? if your forces are between that unit and its home forces, can it defend itself? to rejoin its home force, it would have to move thru enemy lines, or does it have to continue to the edge of the map and sit there? tough question..

_________________
B. Gen. W. Stewart
4/2 ANV


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:58 pm
Posts: 91
Location: Carolina Shores, NC
An excellent question! How about something like they cannot make any offensive maneuver until they are no longer detached. Their effectiveness as observers is another issue. Maybe they should be required to move towards their own lines at maximum movement.

_________________
Lt. Gen. Steve Sober, ACWGC
UMA Chief of Staff
UA Cabinet Secretary


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 10:42 pm
Posts: 220
I'm a little surprised that this issue has not been addressed before now as a house rule.

I'll draft something up (probably along the lines suggested by MG Sober) and post it here for comments and to identify any flaws in it.

_________________
Paul Swanson
Major-General
Army of Northern Virginia


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 7:43 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2001 3:26 pm
Posts: 168
Location:
The house rule that I have always followed is this:

Small units (fewer than 100 strength) and all skirmishers found behind enemy lines should seek shelter in covered terrain and stay there until a path to their own lines is open. Formed units of greater strength are allowed to wreck havoc if able to do so.

Generally, though, units isolated behind enemy lines should 1) move in the direction of friendly forces if they can; 2) move to and remain in covered terrain; 3) not be used as "eyes" for the army they are separated from. Of course, the engine will enable players to see from such routed and isolated units but they should not be moved to some high hill and used as spotters.

_________________
BG Ken 'Muddy' Jones
1st Brigade/3rd Division/XV Corps/Army of Tennessee
USA


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 10:42 pm
Posts: 220
ken jones wrote:
The house rule that I have always followed is this:

[1]Small units (fewer than 100 strength) and all skirmishers found behind enemy lines should seek shelter in covered terrain and stay there until a path to their own lines is open. Formed units of greater strength are allowed to wreck havoc if able to do so.

[2]Generally, though, units isolated behind enemy lines should 1) move in the direction of friendly forces if they can; 2) move to and remain in covered terrain; 3) not be used as "eyes" for the army they are separated from. Of course, the engine will enable players to see from such routed and isolated units but they should not be moved to some high hill and used as spotters.


[1] To limit the rule to small units would seem to distinctly disadvantage the CSA. It is often the larger, low quality USA units that can find themselves in this situation. The more men there are I would think it the more difficult to control any concerns they have let alone convince a larger body of men to head off and conduct independent offensive actions behind the lines.

[2] I've tried to incorporate this thinking as best I can. I can't see that much can be done about what is 'seen' if they're moving back to their own lines. Of course, if they stop in a position where they can see others then they can also be seen.

How does this sound?

Detached Units Behind Enemy Lines
1. Any detached units that find themselves behind enemy lines must not conduct any offensive actions except where they can trace a line free of known enemy zone-of-control to their attached Brigade Commander (or replacement Brigade Commander).
2. Wherever possible any movement by such units must be towards friendly forces not behind enemy lines.

My reasoning for some terms
'known enemy zone-of-control' - it is possible (e.g. forested areas) that such units will not be aware of all enemy units (let alone their ZOC but if they think they have contact with their leader they will be reassured by that thinking.
'wherever possible any movement' - unknown enemy units prevent moving routed units in some directions and if the unit (routed or otherwise) can not move towards their own lines then they should stay where they are (which seems preferable to them heading off to undertake spotting duties or placing themselves in positions where, although not an offensive action, their defensive fire is effectively offensive in nature).


Forwarded for consideration and comments.

_________________
Paul Swanson
Major-General
Army of Northern Virginia


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 6 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 46 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group