ACWGC Forums

American Civil War Game Club

* ACWGC    * Dpt. of Records (DoR)    *Club Recruiting Office     ACWGC Memorial

* CSA HQ    * VMI   * Join CSA    

* Union HQ   * UMA   * Join Union    

CSA Armies:   ANV   AoT

Union Armies:   AotT    AotC    AotP    AotS     Union Army Forums

Link Express

Club Forums:     NWC    CCC     Home Pages:     NWC    CCC    ACWGC
It is currently Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:39 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 14, 2017 1:55 am
Posts: 375
Location: Tennessee
Read this from another Club's forum regarding JTS Civil War games in general:

Some players will do things that rarely happened in the Civil War: splitting off individual regiments and sometimes whole brigades from their parent divisions and corps by huge distances, on independent missions. While done on very rare occasions this, while perfectly legal in game terms can sometimes ruin things for someone who wants to play within the spirit of the period being simulated.

Put another way, while you can deploy and maneuver as is if units are in radio communication, there just is no way Civil War commanders could do that. Telegraph maybe, but most orders were verbal or written and delivered by courier.

That's every individual's choice of course, and I respect that. I just don't like to do it, and try to work things out with any prospective opponent before getting started.


Just made me think is all.

_________________
Maj. Gen. Blake
Confederate CoS - CSA Cabinet Member
El Presidente 2010 - 2012

Image


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:07 am
Posts: 2190
Location: Alba
I am guilty of doing this on a regular basis, however I always pay for it, my command and control goes out the window and my army becomes hopelessly disorganised. As I understand it the command and control in JTS makes it unattractive to take units away from their command structures.

_________________
General Cam McOmish

Army Commander
Confederate Army of Tennessee

CSA


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2020 10:42 pm
Posts: 218
Yes, "splitting off individual regiments and sometimes whole brigades from their parent divisions and corps by huge distances, on independent missions" is unrealistic and not really "within the spirit of the period being simulated".

I have done such a thing on several occasions but from memory it has always been for the same reason. A Yankee unit routs and heads off behind my lines, usually into forest, so I then dispatch two or three units to hunt him down to prevent him recovering at a later time and emerging behind me and possibly attacking artillery batteries in the rear.

If an opponent of mine wants to split off individual units as a matter of course I will not interfere as he will be penalised by certain aspects of the game functions [CSA members can read all about it in a fine article titled 'LDR 301 - Command and Leadership' in The VMI War Library and Study Room].
If game penalties are insufficient to prevent such tactics being employed then just think what would happen once one of these individual regiments is discovered by the enemy. If I am fortunate enough to uncover a single unit or a small number of them while I have numerical superiority over them as part of my battle line that unit will be shown no quarter. With a bit of luck none of them will live to tell the tale of their independent mission far from the support of their comrades.

_________________
Paul Swanson
Major-General
Army of Northern Virginia


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 14, 2017 1:55 am
Posts: 375
Location: Tennessee
A very amusing but completely impossible Optional Rule could be:

A/I Brigade Command Optional Rule
- Any brigade commander outside of his divisional commander's radius will automatically be controlled by the A/I. All units of his command will not be movable by the player until the brigade commander is back under the command radius of the divisional commander for one turn. Orders may be given the BC through the Command Dialogue box while detached.

WORST RULE EVER! But it would sure as hell make everyone stay within the radius! We'd also have to bring back the command dialogue box from the dead (where I think it is since the old TS games).

Jason talking about HARDCORE wargaming - there you go.

_________________
Maj. Gen. Blake
Confederate CoS - CSA Cabinet Member
El Presidente 2010 - 2012

Image


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:44 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:31 pm
Posts: 89
Brother Officers:

1. Routed Units recover and attack from the rear. I prefer a house rule for this; it being a gentleman's agreement that such units must move into a forested hex of the opponent's choosing with 1 hex visibility (to prevent them acting as scouts) and remain there for the duration of the game. As a tit-for-tat, the other player agrees not to hunt them down and kill them.

2. Unit separation. Agree. Wandering all over the battlefield is clearly NOT a ACW tactical device. The only exception here would be cavalry. I can see (and do so employ) small detachments ( usually < 100) being sent to post good high ground to provide early warning of enemy movements. Conversely, I have played opponents who used artillery sections as observation posts! I believe the exiting in-game rule address this well enough, as several of you have stated.

I am quick to note that widely dispersed units is not the WORST ahistorical gaming atrocity I have witnessed !

_________________
J.L. Boling
Major General, USA
General-in-Chief
United States Army


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2004 7:00 pm
Posts: 797
Location: Mukilteo, Washington, USA - 25 miles north of Seattle
Gentlemen, Sirs! <salute>

The one thing I miss from Richard Berg's Great Battles of the American Civil War (GBACW) series was the Brigade Combat Effectiveness (BCE) Loss whereby once a certain level of losses were exceeded for that brigade, no unit of that brigade could initiate melee attack and a 1 was added to the die roll for all morale checks.

Respectfully,

Your Obedient Servant,


General Nick Kunz
Chief of Staff,
Army of Northern Virginia

Image
Image


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Just Saw This
PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:44 am 
Online

Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 3:24 pm
Posts: 1030
Location: Terra
Wonder if that is really needed when every unit gains fatigue and by that, on higher fatigue levels, already looses effectiveness themselves. On top of the also a brigade penalty seems a bit much maybe.

_________________
Lieutenant General Christian Hecht
Commander I Corps, Army of the Potomac
Image


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 38 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group