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 Post subject: 1806 OOB
PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:37 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:55 am
Posts: 815
Location: Bouches-de-l’Elbe
As I worked through the #10_OOB_View.scn to compare the French & Prussian/Saxon forces I stumbled over some things, a lot is of minor if any importance but I thought I put it all into here, no sense in doing it half-hearted.
The things of more importance are some of the mix ups between some Prussian & Saxon units and some missing French COs and corrections for artillery.
I must mention that except for my check on the KR11 I haven't checked if any of my advised changes would lead to a change in uniform

Prussian infantry/cavalry units
-- Phantom Officer in Prince Henry Brigade(under Right Wing/Main) is Prince Henry and the Prince Henry under the Cavalry Brigade is instead Prince Wilhelm.
-- The unit "Gren. Braun" should be named "Alt-Braun" while the unit "Braun Gren" should be named "Jung-Braun".
-- Rutz IR8 should be named Rüts IR8.
-- Schonong IR11 should be named Schöning IR11.
-- 2/Besser IR14 should be named 1/Besser IR14, the 2nd bat. was in Graudenz and the 3rd in Danzig.
-- The Garde-zu-Fuss IR15 was named "Regiment Garde" as the designation Garde-zu-Fuss was introduced after the defeat in 1806. The 1st bat. of the Garde-zu-Fuss IR15 should be designated as "1 Leibgarde/Regiment Garde IR15" instead. And regarding uniforms, only the 3rd bat. seems to have worn the grenadier hat.
-- Brnshwg-Oels IR12 is instead Braunschweig IR21. IR12 was with the corps of Karl August von Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach that later joined Blücher on his march to Lübeck.
-- I'm rather confused about Hessen-Kassel IR 48.
First, the regimental owner was by then Kürfürst von Hessen, the term Hessen-Kassel refers more to the Landgraviate of Hesse-Kassel than to the regiments owner William I, Elector of Hesse.
Second, several sources point to the Saxon Kurfürst Regiment instead of the Kürfürst von Hessen IR48 that is under Belvilaqua command.
Third, one source puts the IR 48 under Rüchel's Corps, but I wasn't able to verify this in any other sources, either because not all of Rüchels units took part in the battle or because the generals Winning and Saxe-Weimar that were detached from Rüchel and who missed Jena-Auerstedt had this unit.
So if it's really the Saxon Kürfürst regiment the uniform must be changed.
-- Rename S/IR#49 to S/Müffling IR49 to be consistent with the way other Schützen units are designated.
-- Rename FB#4 Greiffenberg to Greiffenberg FB4 to be consistent with the way other Füsilier units are designated.
-- Rename FB#8 Kloch to Kloch FB8 to be consistent with the way other Füsilier units are designated.
-- Unsure but shouldn't Borell FB9 be named Vernay FB9? Full name was Borel du Vernay so at least Borel instead Borell should be used.
-- Rename Ruhle FB15 to Rühle FB15.
-- Rename Schatmeyer FB23 to Schachtmeyer FB23.
-- For consistency change Jager to Jäger
-- Unsure but shouldn't Schimlpfning HR6 be named Oye HR6? Full name was Schimmelpfennig von der Oye.
-- Likely not just 4 but 8 squadrons of Usedom HR10 were under Cav/ResK.
-- Ansbach HR11 should be named Bila HB11 as it wasn't a regiment but the Husaren-Bataillon 11 under v. Bila formed in 1792 in Berlin in the wake of the Ansbach-Bayreuth takeover.
-- Unsure but shouldn't Henckel KR1 be named Donnersmarck KR1? Full name was Henckel von Donnersmarck.
-- Gendarmes KR10 should be named Gens d`armes KR10.
-- Leib Karab. KR11 should be named Leib Carab. KR11.
-- Gd du Korps KR13 should be named Gd du Corps KR13.
-- Remove Auer DR6 from the EPC as it was in Korps L‘Estocq who was on the Ems stationed.
-- 5/Hertzberg DR9 is missing, on purpose?
-- 5/Heyking DR10 is missing, on purpose?

Saxon infantry/cavalry units
-- As the Saxons neither officially nor unofficially used numbers for their regiments the best way, for numbering regiments is by order of formation as used by Tessin(Check https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_der_kursächsischen_Regimenter_der_Frühen_Neuzeit ). That leads besides name corrections to the renumbering of all Saxon infantry and some Saxon cavalry regiments.
-- Niesemueschel IR11 should be Niesemeuschel IR2.
-- Low IR8 should be Low IR3.
-- Pr Maximilian IR5 should be Prinz Maximilian IR4.
-- Pr Clemens IR4 should be Prinz Clemens IR5
-- Xavier IR9 should be Prinz Xaver IR8.
-- Rechten IR12 should be Rechten IR10.
-- Thümmel IR6 should be Thümmel IR12.
-- 2/Ryssel IR10 should be 2/Bevilaqua IR13.
-- Leib Karab. KR11 under Kochtisky is designated wrong as KR11 because it's supposed to be one of the Saxon Cuirassier regiments. It seems to be a mix up with the Prussian Carabiner regiment under Prince Henry as that was KR11. And as the mix up with the Prussian Carabiner must come from somewhere my guess it is the Saxon Zezschwitz KR7 is meant because that regiment had the term Carabiner used some years before.
I think there is also a mix up in the uniforms as the orange uniform of the Leib Karab. KR11 under Prince Henry is depicting a Saxon regiment because the Prussian uniform was like this:
The Leib Karab. KR11 under Kochtisky has those white uniform but it's a Saxon regiment so I think the units have to switch their uniforms.
-- Koschitizky KR3 should be named Kochtitzky KR3
-- Polenz CL4 should be Polenz CL2.

Prussian/Saxon artillery units
-- Add to Bonniot FAB extension (a), (b), etc. to make clear these are no multiple entries but a split battery.
-- Add to Ernst FAB extension (a) & (b) to make clear these are no multiple entries but a split battery.
-- Add to Hausmer FAB extension (a) & (b) to make clear these are no multiple entries but a split battery.
-- Add to Grossmann HAB extension (a) and (b) to make clear this is no double entry but a split battery.
- In the Brigade Bevilaqua(Belvilaqua/AdvGd) the Foot Battery Hoyer with 4-pounders is missing, could it be there in addition or instead of the battalion guns? The artillery loadout is very uncertain, some source say 20 some say 44(of which 33 were lost at Saalfeld) for the Advance Guard of Hohenlohe.
(Osprey Camapign 20 notes that the Prussian reserve batteries of 12 6-pounders were often distributed as regimental guns, so maybe the Hoyer foot battery provided the battalion guns.)

French units
-- Cav/IC is missing the 3rd regimental colonel.
-- Cav/VC is missing 3rd CO for regiment, or can it be that the 3 Brigade Generals do each one command one cavalry regiment and that there is no overall cops cavalry commander?
-- 4th Corps artillery is strange, the 17th co. 5th Foot Artillery Reg. shows up 4 times. I can only advise to make the smaller foot artillery units of 4th corps "17 Co/5 Regt Foot" as that company seems to have been spread over all division and the corps artillery reserve. It also seems the 12pdr is to numerous, 4th corps artillery strength on wikipedia/Osprey is 52 guns is:
1st Div. Artillery: 2x 12-pound guns, 8x 6-pound guns & 2x 6-inch howitzers spread over 12th and 17th (-) companies of 5th Foot Artillery Regiment
2nd Div. Artillery: 2x 12-pound guns, 8x 6-pound guns & 2x 6-inch howitzers spread over 13th and 17th (-) companies of 5th Foot Artillery Regiment
3rd Div. Artillery: 4x 12-pound guns, 6x 6-pound guns & 2x 6-inch howitzers spread over 14th and 17th (-) companies of 5th Foot Artillery Regiment
Corps Artillery: 8x 6-pound guns, 2x 6-inch howitzers, spread over 16th and 17th (-) companies of 5th Foot Artillery Regiment
Wiki has no artillery attached to the corps cavalry but Osprey gives:
Cavalry Artillery: 4x 8-pound guns & 2x 6-inch howitzers in 4th company of 5th Horse Artillery Regiment
-- 6th corps artillery is strange too, overall numbers are 4x 12-pound guns, 12x 8-pound guns, 4x 4-pound guns & 4x 6-inch howitzers but ingame we have 12x 12-pound guns as foot artillery and 12x 6-pound guns as horse artillery, while the same amount the type of guns make it look liek the ingame artillery is heavier than the historical OOBs suggest.
-- 2 Co/6 Regt Foot of 1st Division 7th Corps is supposed to be horse artillery. And that company is split between the 1st and 2nd Div of 7th corps so numbers must be adjusted too as each division is supposed to have 8 guns.

Capitaine Christian Hecht
La Grande Armée - IIIe Corps d'Armée - 3ème Division d'Infanterie
"Vive Napoleon!"


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 Post subject: Re: 1806 OOB
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:40 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:55 am
Posts: 815
Location: Bouches-de-l’Elbe
A serious problem is the composition of Rüchels corps, often OOBs show under Rüchel the Generals Winning & Saxe-Weimar but that is likely wrong as Saxe-Weimar & Winning were detached and so far away that both missed the battle.
Winning was South-West of Eisennach and Saxe-Weimar was near Ilemnau and the evening of the 13th October.

The problem now is that the units of at least Saxe-Weimar do not seem to be in the OOB, that means the Rüchel corps isn't supposed to let out its Corps de Batille that the game OOB currently has under the command of Saxe-Weimar.
I'll try to find some detailed information of the Rüchel corps to see what he really had at hand and of the detached forces under Saxe-Weimar & Winning to make sure everything of Rüchel that could participate at Jena-Auerstedt is in the OOB.

For now some numbers must be enough.
Rüchel had on the 14th October:
19 bat. infantry
1 co. jäger
18 sq. cavalry
3.5 bat. artillery
Overall 15260 men.
That already excludes some reserves, 2 bat. near Erfurt and 2 sq. detached to Hohenlohe.

Winning was near Eisennach with:
3.5 bat. infantry
2 co. jäger
10 sq. cavalry
0.5 bat. horse artillery
0.5 bat. foot artillery

Things to correct for sure are to remove Winning and Saxe-Weimar as they did not participate in Jena-Auerstedt.

Capitaine Christian Hecht
La Grande Armée - IIIe Corps d'Armée - 3ème Division d'Infanterie
"Vive Napoleon!"


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 Post subject: Re: 1806 OOB
PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:38 pm 

Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 10:18 am
Posts: 5259
Hi Christian - if you want to work with me to correct JUST the names of the units in this OB, and any others in the game, I will be sure to give you a free copy of Campaign Eylau-Friedland (CEF) when its finished.

I know I would not have the time (or the mental energy) to do all of this.

Once the game was out I was able to acquire the lovely book by Emperor's Press which was translated by Bowden and another man. In there I noted some mistakes in the OB file. However, I cannot switch units around. The scenarios would not open.

You are welcome to come up with a correct OB and publish it yourself. Just remove the units that are incorrect and then change the OB name in the scenario file with yours and then add the units back in again. I remember that the Advance Guard was incorrect.

Contact me via PM or email if you want to do the corrections to the names. If we do this it would have to be to ALL of the OB files as we would not want to have incorrect names in the other files as well.

General der Kavallerie Wilhelm Prinz Peters von Dennewitz
Husaren-Regiment Hessen-Kassel
Infanterie-Brigade Hessen-Kassel
Königlich-Preußisches Armee-Korps
Scenario Designer for Napoleonic Battles series - John Tiller Software

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