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Newbie question about resounding defeats
http://www.wargame.ch/board/acwgc/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14196		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Cruces [ Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Newbie question about resounding defeats
If you are in a long scenario and you have been thumped and have little chance to recover (Army is in rout and enemy is triumphant)what is the generally accepted behavior.

Should you gut it out to the bitter end or resign and start another game.

Lt. Elkin
1/3/8/AOS

It's just like shooting squirrels, only these squirrels have guns
Author:  nelmsm [ Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
I generally offer my opponent the victory or defeat as the case may be and will continue on if they so desire. Some people like to fight to the bitter end either way and since I accepted the game I'll give them that opportunity, but tuck that info in the back of my mind when considering future games.

General Mark Nelms
6/3/IX/AoO
"Blackhawk Brigade"
Union Military Academy Instructor
Union Cabinet Secretary
Author:  warbison [ Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
<font face="Book Antiqua"><font size="4"><font color="beige">Lt Elkin,

If you wish to end a scenario early when getting thumped then offer your opponent his Major Victory. As Mark states, some wish to continue to the bitter end. If I am on the receiving end of a good whuppin then I have lost interest in the fight, for me better to get it over with and move on.

In the Campaign games of HPS, you have the options of submitting for a termination bid, these are not automatic Major Victories as both parties my wish to move the campaign forward. Lots of these scenarios for me have ended in a mutual Draw to continue the fight elsewhere.

I was recently in a maneuver fight and had a commanding terrian to defend, had held pretty well early on and did some damage with my artillery. BUT, the overwhelming Rebel forces (what a change that was) pushed me off the hill and surrounded and routed my entire army. It made no sense to continue to the last man (which never happened in the ACW, they either surrendered or fled the battlefield) so the fight was ended.

Regards,
</font id="beige"></font id="size4"></font id="Book Antiqua">

<font color="limegreen"><font size="4">Gen Nick Kunz
Image
Commanding
3/4/II Corps
Army of Georgia</font id="limegreen"></font id="size4">
Author:  D.S. Walter [ Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:19 am ]
Post subject: 
In a standalone fight, surrender at will, if the situation is really hopeless (don't decide that on a whim, however, say in deep frustration about a failed attack or some such; wait 24 hours and see if you're not willing to continue), and if you've seriously done all that you can to pull the thing off. Surrendering very early in a long game, however, can be frustrating for your opponent. Most people want a good fight first, a win second.

It's certainly different in a *campaign* when losses carry over. Surrendering in an impossible position (say a part of your army is completely surrounded) can actually be an advantage to you and a disadvantage to your opponent. "Offering" to surrender in such a situation could be interpreted as trying to get away on the cheap and to spare yourself the consequences of your defeat. At least you shouldn't be surprised when your opponent refused to accept the bid.

Gen. Walter, USA
<i>The Blue Blitz</i>
3/2/VIII AoS
West Point Class of '01
[url="http://www.home.datacomm.ch/dierk.walter/2VIIIAoS/persrecord.htm"]Image[/url] Image Image
"... and keep moving on."
Author:  D.S. Walter [ Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:21 am ]
Post subject: 
BTW we generally tend to write the corps numbers in roman numerals, not arabic ones.
Author:  KWhitehead [ Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:25 am ]
Post subject: 
For individual battle scenarios if you are sure you can't get back to a marginal then go ahead and offer the Major Victory to your opponent. Generally you will find neither side wants to beat a dead horse. :)

Just be sure it is hopeless. I have had many people surrender Gettysburg battles to me on the first day forgetting over half their army hasn't showed up yet.

Campaigns are a different problem. If you plan to continue the campaign then you will have to fight the battle out since casualties affect the battles that follow. Sometimes you will run into an exception like 2nd Winchester. The Union always loses this one. It is set up that way. For some reason they made it a two day battle but it is usually over on the first day and early offer by the Union player of a Major CSA Victory gets the campaign moving. There are a few more scenarios in various campaigns where the best tactic is to immediately exit the map. Let the other player know that is what you intend to do and work out an early end to the scenario so both of you can move on to the next battle. This one is also the case where you don't need to offer an extra victory level since the battle may be a Marginal or even Draw by exiting and waiting the turns out.

LG. Kennon Whitehead
Chatham Grays
1/1/III AoM (CSA)
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