Colonial Campaigns Club (CCC)
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2D vs 3D
https://www.wargame.ch/board/cc/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2071		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Gary McClellan [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 5:59 am ]
Post subject:  2D vs 3D
Just a random musing of mine. I know some people use 3d, and some use 2d in viewing the game, and that's all fine obviously. Whichever you prefer is a good thing.

The thought hit me though, my wargaming background is for all intents and purposes 100% boardgame. While I wanted to get minatures, a lack of time, money (big issue), opponents, and a severe lack of fine motor coordination that made painting the things a terrifying prospect kept me firmly in the boardgame camp.

So, when I got the BG games, and the later HPS developments of the system, I rather naturally gravitated to the 2D view, as being very familiar and comfortable.

My question (finally) is this. Is this just something with me, or is there a correlation, that boardgamers tend toward the 2D view and minature players towards the 3D? Speak up if you will and say, your preferred view and your background (if any).

Thank you for your time.

Gary McClellan
Private
36th Infantry
1812-R
Author:  Al Amos [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 6:45 am ]
Post subject: 
Miniature gamer since 1971.

I play in 3d.

However, I played boardgames, too, especially the big monster games .... Europa series, TSS, Wellington's Victory, the la Bataille series, etc ... so I plan my battles and review that plan, each turn, in 2d.

In 3d I keep bases off, and highlight objectives, contours and organization.



Major Al Amos
1st U.S. Dragoons 1812-R

[url="http://www.angelfire.com/ok4/amos/CCC/1812regulars.htm"]<img src="http://www.angelfire.com/ok4/amos/CCC/chippewa_s.gif " border=0>[/url]
Author:  David O Connor [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 8:12 am ]
Post subject: 
Good question!
Miniature Wargamer since 1981 (although I'm bigger now..) <img src=icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle>

I use 3D zoomed out view - although like Al I use the 2D/Zoom map for tactical planning (too many years of playing SPI/AH games!)

CCC Rank = Major(bvt Gen)
CinC Colonial/US Army
Author:  D.S. Walter [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 8:45 am ]
Post subject: 
Neither boardgames, nor miniatures. I do almost precisely the same as Al, only with visible hexes on instead of contours.

<font color=red>Capt. Walter
4th Regiment "King's Own"
AdC, Royal North American Corps of 1812</font id=red>
Author:  Richard [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 4:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Miniature Wargamer 1976-81, I stopped playing with miniatures a couple of years before I left school - well, everyone was getting into D&D by then so I couldn't find any opponents! I've still got a fair number (hundreds if not thousands) of 25mm figs on permanent display - despite my wife's complaints about dust - as well as a more recent (acquired entirely within the last 5 years) collection of 5mm Ancient & ECW figures for the occasional solo wargame.

For computer wargames I always use 2D for movement (and usually 2D zoom out for planning/overview), but tend to switch to 3D for firing & melee. For long range artillery fire I may need to switch back to 2D to find the target! This may take longer than playing entirely in 2D, but it does enhance the game.
Author:  Ernie Sands [ Wed Dec 05, 2001 7:25 pm ]
Post subject: 
I use only 2D. I have never played more than a few minutes at 3d on any game. I find 3D much more confusing and cluttered. 2D is crisp and clear and elevations, LOS, etc are soooo much easier. I am/was a BOARDGAMER

<b><font color=red>Ernie Sands
Col, 3rd East Kent,CCC
LtCol,1 Konig,VIII,AdR
BG,CO XXIII Corps AoO
President, Colonial Camp Club
Sch,183Inf,VIII,PzC
Pvt B Co, 3/3-MBC </b></font id=red>
Author:  Pvt Phil Squair [ Thu Dec 06, 2001 6:12 am ]
Post subject: 
Always 2D. I've actually deleted a lot of the 3D graphics and sounds to save hard drive space.

Boardgamer background in SPI.

Phil Squair
The Mad Moravians
Author:  Gary McClellan [ Thu Dec 06, 2001 6:21 am ]
Post subject: 
Very interesting, at least in large scale, my initial theses seems to be holding up.

Boardgamers go to 2D, while Minature (and mixed I notice) go 3-D, while of course, Dierk is the wierdo with no background <img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

Gary McClellan
Private
36th Infantry
1812-R
Author:  ld5253 [ Thu Dec 06, 2001 11:13 am ]
Post subject: 
I use all views, and glance through them all as I do each turn with the line of sight feature turned on. My main movement is in the 2d, but going to 3d helps me better guage my opponents next move. I only played board games in days of old. Being a re-enactor, I get a kick out of seeing the uniforms close up, so the zoom 3d provides another enjoyable dimension (is that a pun?) to the game

Larry Davis
Captain of
His Royal Majesty's
64th regiment of Foot
on the CCC
Author:  Mike Cox [ Thu Dec 06, 2001 8:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
2d Zoomed out for the replay and 2d normal for my moves. Always highlight organization, objectives on.

Boardgamer since I was a kid. I thought computers were invented to give me opponents for gaming. (Oh yeah, I had reports to write too.)

Anyone remeber a game called Tanks? - It was a board game but the computer told you where to move the counters. Graphics? Who needs graphics?


Cpt. Mike Cox
New Jersey Militia
(1st Hunterdon Cty)
AdC American Army
Author:  pkpowers [ Fri Dec 07, 2001 12:08 am ]
Post subject: 
I played naval minatures and most land warfare boardgames by Avalon Hill.
I use 2d views all the time.
And as was mentioned earlier,once I deleted all 3d and sounds to free up drive space.

Hey Mike, the game you mentioned was "Tanktics" by AH,yes---- no graphics--- just type in the hex numbers you wanted tanks to move to, and I still have it.
Played it on the Atari 800. Also have Jagdpanzer and my all-time favorite, Kamfpgruppe....

Brg.General, "Texas Division", Army of Georgia....
Major,Eastern Department,Continental Army....
Capt., Army du Nord....
(Renegade Mercenary Partisan Armored Tank Commander in various other clubs)
Author:  780 [ Tue Dec 11, 2001 2:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I want to win - 2D, if I want the full color of the period - 3D.
Prefer to stick to 2D as it allows you to see the terrain better. Would hope that John Tiller will introduce a Reverse View as in the Talonsoft WW2 Campaign series. That would really help find those hidden streams that hide behind the contours.
Like Al and the others I painted and played miniatures for years. Thought that the BG series was gorgeous in 3D but playing in that mode left me losing almost every battle. I really didnt want to play in 2D but alas there was no Reverse Map view so I was forced to go to the less graphically interesting view.
How many guys out there painted 15mm Swedes for 30 Years War? Johnny Reb - North or South? How about Empire II (that dates me!). I built the X Corps for 1812 (Prussians, Westphalians, Bavarians, Poles) in Minifig 25mm as well as a ton of Russians (Scruby 25mm). Really took to the 15mm size - built a ton of Landsknects for the WRG rules. Once I found out how to use the dark colors to fill in the cracks painting really became a joy. Am still considering it for the future! Might build some more ECW/30 years war stuff.

Capt. Bill Peters, Morgan's Rifles, American Army (retired)
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