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| Missing Half Turns? https://www.wargame.ch/board/cc/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3615 |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 7:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Missing Half Turns? |
In a recent game of FIW #059 Quebec_a, the scenario started with a French move on turn 1, then immediately went to a British move on turn 2, and the game ended on turn 12 with a French move. It was as if the game skipped a British move for turn 1, and the French had the first and last moves in the game. Philip Prete is a tough enough opponent without giving him a first and last move I say! [:)] I've seen this in a few other scenarios but it didn't click with me till I noticed it in this short game. Is skipping a half turn intentional in some scenarios or is this a design oversight? Phil |
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| Author: | Mike Cox [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 8:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
It relates to the pdt used. The scenario determines who moves first, but the pdt determines who is "player one". Mike CiC American |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 8:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks Mike. I'd still like to know if this is part of a scenario's intentional design in these instances or a small oversight. If intentional what's the basis for one side having a first and last turn? |
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| Author: | D.S. Walter [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 8:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
In well over 300 games in several clubs I have never seen that the first side would have the last move as well. |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
In perhaps half a dozen games I've played I remember briefly chatting with my opponent about suddenly finding ourselves in turn two when only one side moved in turn one. I always just chalked it up to something we might have missed, but in Quebec_a the French definately have the first and last move. If one side is supposed to move first for whatever reason that's fine, but I think there's something wrong when the same side starts and finishes the game with their own moves. Am I missing something here? |
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| Author: | D.S. Walter [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I think I have seen that turn 2 thing too, Phil, but I also think that the second side had still that last move. I always look this up in the victory dialogue, to find out who has the last move, and I can't recall it was ever wrong. |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 10:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Click through the 12 short turns of FIW #059 and you'll see 12 French turns to 11 British. Can the victory dialog be read from a file Dierk, if so which one? |
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| Author: | D.S. Walter [ Sat Sep 06, 2003 10:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Damnation--you're right. [:0] No wonder I never noticed, it's true that the second side always has the last move. Only it seems it can at the same time have the first move as well. What a nonsense. |
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| Author: | G Cope [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 5:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I don't know about the first and last move, but have noticed on many ocassions the game skipping half a turn. I have just chalked this up to my recognition that I'm becoming senile [:(] Now I see there is still hope for me [8D] |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 6:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I do not keep track of turns, in any of the games. I will start to do so, but I have a sense that they all have played through. I am wondering if this has anything to do with being the SECOND player starting the game. Quite often, I just start a game and I am the second player and it goes right to the END TURN phase and I send the file off. I have never noticed if it is STILL my 1st turn when I get it back. I have one of those in my inbox right now, so will look at it more closely. |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 6:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Ok. I just started a game vs Phil Prete and I started it as SECOND player. I got it back from him and I am on my turn 2!! I had NO FIRST TURN. So, effectively, Phil has one more turn than me? I need all the turns I can get!!!!!!!![}:)][;)] I am going to test real quick vs the AI. |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 6:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
HMMMMMM! I started a PBEM game vs myself and started as the British, sent it, played the American 1st turn and ended it and when I played it as the British I was on turn #2. I started it as the Americans and played the FIRST turn and then played as the British and got the SECOND turn, anyway. Sent it to the Americans and they were on TURN #2. I don't have the time today to play out an entire game (I don't actually play it just move from turn to turn) in PBEM mode or in vs AI mode, to see if there are "missing" turns. |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 6:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
One side having the first move in the last half of the first turn is not a problem if they're supposed to move first. The problem is then that this same side finishes out the last turn with a move also, giving them one extra move over the other side. And Ernie you're right, it's not an advantage you want Mr. Prete to have. [;)] |
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| Author: | Al Amos [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 9:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Problem: Brits lose 1/2 turn whenever the French MOVE first. Reason: The pdt file is set for the Brit player to be the 'First Player'. In many scenarios the tactical situation calls for the French to move first. The unfortunate side effect has been noted previously in this thread. Solution: create a pdt file for the French to be 'First Player', and alter any scenario witj the French moving first to use this new pdt file, AND alter victory conditions, if necessary, since many victory conditions are set to reflect the Brits being the 'First Player.' |
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| Author: | 367 [ Sun Sep 07, 2003 10:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks Al. Being the designer of Quebec_a, can you get this fixed please? If anyone else notices this flaw in other scenarios please report them. |
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