Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)
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On this day 300 ago...
https://www.wargame.ch/board/nwc/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10419		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Kosyanenko [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  On this day 300 ago...
...the most difficult and bloody battle of the Northern War took place. The battle of Poltava. Swedish army under Karl XII was decisively beaten and was almost completely annihilated on pursuit by Russian troops under Peter the Great. History knows only a few examples of this kind. After this defeat Sweden could not pretend to be a major power any longer. Russia was on the down of it's century long invincibility period which was broken at Austerlitz.

Let us remember those who fought on both sides. And let us celebrate the victory. URA!

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<center><b>Eyo Imperatorskogo Velichestva Leib-Kirassirskogo polku
General-Adjutant Anton Valeryevich Kosyanenko
Commander of the Second Army of the West </b></center>
Author:  Al Amos [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
Would you mind telling us the name of the battle? Thanks. [;)]

al
Author:  John Corbin [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Poltava I think

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<center>Monsieur le Marechal Baron John Corbin
Commanding L'Armee du Rhin
Grande Duc de Piave et Comte de Beauvais
Commanding the Division de Cavalerie de la Moyenne Garde
NWC President</center>
Author:  Kosyanenko [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Thanks Al and John. I somehow missed the part with the battle name. [:I] Poltava of course.

Today 219 years ago happened the biggest naval battle on Baltic sea and one of the biggest (in terms of ship numbers) battles in naval history. 2nd Svensksund or Rochensalm. Russian fleet suffered a major humiliation from Swedes. It somewhat compensated the defeat suffered by Swedish fleet a week before at Vyborg.

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<center><b>Eyo Imperatorskogo Velichestva Leib-Kirassirskogo polku
General-Adjutant Anton Valeryevich Kosyanenko
Commander of the Second Army of the West </b></center>
Author:  Ed Blackburn [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:03 am ]
Post subject: 
A timely post Anton, I am actually reading a book about Peter the Great by Robert Massie. Peter was also the father of the Russian Navy, he loved sailing and ship building, was a master carpenter and assisted in the design and building of warships with his own hands.[8D]

Major General Ed Blackburn
Commanding Second Div, II Corps, AAA
3rd Bn / 1st Regiment of Foot Guards
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Author:  Ed Blackburn [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:03 am ]
Post subject: 
A timely post Anton, I am actually reading a book about Peter the Great by Robert Massie. Peter was also the father of the Russian Navy, he loved sailing and ship building, was a master carpenter and assisted in the design and building of warships with his own hands.[8D]

Major General Ed Blackburn
Commanding Second Div, II Corps, AAA
3rd Bn / 1st Regiment of Foot Guards
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Author:  Bill Peters [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:24 am ]
Post subject: 
200 years ago - Russo-Swedish War. 1808-09.

The Swedes could have held the key fortress, Vyborg, in Finland for some time in but gave it up. Basically the Gibralter of the Baltic.

There are a few good websites on this war. Would folks play it if it was done by HPS? Toying with adding it in as a bonus perhaps in the future.

Colonel Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)
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Author:  Jim Pfleck [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:14 am ]
Post subject: 
Bill, is the a rhetorical question? Would we play it? if it was free?!!?!?!

Feldmarschall Jim 'Prinz' Pfluecke
Commander, Austrian Cavalry Reserve
3 Graf O'Reilly Chevauxleger Rgt
Hahn Grenadier Bn
Author:  Ernie Sands [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:01 am ]
Post subject: 
The battle had about 14000 in the Swedish Army, with Polish and Cossack cavalry. Peter the Great had about 45000 troops.

Charles XII was wounded early in the battle and the command of the Swedish army and its allies mostly fell apart.

Some of the allies on both sides are very interesting.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, 1ère Brigade, 19ème Division, VI Corps, L'Armee du Rhin
President, Colonial Campaign Club
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Author:  Kosyanenko [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:46 am ]
Post subject: 
Bill,

I would. At least I will give it a try. It's one om my favorites. The game MUST be based on extensive research we have. There exists a seven volume history of the Northern wars of Napoleonic era written by Swedish general staff. I know that 5 volumes of it describing the Russo-Swedish conflict are translated into russian. I have collected several memoirs of participants on the Russian side as well as several general descriptions including official version of Mikhailovski-Danilevski. I have regimental histories of several regiments that took part in it. There are several books describing in detail composition and uniforms of the Swedish army. The same about the Russian army is well known. Also I made a list of Russian commanders up to batalion/squadron/artillery company level for Russian side, containing about 2/3 historical names. There are orders of battles collected for most of the engagements (Thanks to Vladimir Komissarenko).There is an oob created, a map and even a sample scenario for the biggest battle of the conflict (Oravais). The work is stopped because it destroys my PhD. And the later I value more. But when it will finally be over I'll finish the scenarios...

Jim et al.,
It would be very important to know that I'm doing this not only for my own pleasure. So far I know only three men in the club including myself who are really interested in it.

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<center><b>Eyo Imperatorskogo Velichestva Leib-Kirassirskogo polku
General-Adjutant Anton Valeryevich Kosyanenko
Commander of the Second Army of the West </b></center>
Author:  Jim Pfleck [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:10 am ]
Post subject: 
I am no expert on this conflict, but I am interested in things I know little about, which is one reason why I am enjoying the Renassaince game so much...


Feldmarschall Jim 'Prinz' Pfluecke
Commander, Austrian Cavalry Reserve
3 Graf O'Reilly Chevauxleger Rgt
Hahn Grenadier Bn
Author:  Ernie Sands [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:29 am ]
Post subject: 
This conflict was interesting beyond the battles. The allied armies on each side were, politically, very varied. Cossacks vs the Russians and other political and ethnic entities.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, 1ère Brigade, 19ème Division, VI Corps, L'Armee du Rhin
President, Colonial Campaign Club
</b></font id="gold">
Author:  Bill Peters [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:07 am ]
Post subject: 
I have figured that the only way I would do this campaign is to have two helpers, one Russian, one Swedish, to help me.

I have the Swedish helper but have yet to decide on a Russian helper. And the project is unfortunately low priority and I may never be able to do it due to having to take on full time work again.

I may turn it over to a design team to do and then just reimburse them. That is another option I am exploring. The problem with that is that then I run the risk of the project never getting done.

But its something I am pondering. I just am not set on doing it yet. Being that I am Swedish I like seeing the Swedes involved more but I also am looking at the popularity of it too.

Hence the question if folks would play it. Its not the same as if Waterloo is more popular than Jena (it is ...). Its the idea that if it was packaged with another game would it just be a sideshow and not get played that much.

Colonel Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)
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Author:  Prince Repnin [ Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Bill Peters</i>
<br />. ...Being that I am Swedish I like seeing the Swedes involved more but I also am looking at the popularity of it too.
Hence the question if folks would play it. Its not the same as if Waterloo is more popular than Jena (it is ...). Its the idea that if it was packaged with another game would it just be a sideshow and not get played that much.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I'm not a Swedish, Bill, but I'm looking forward eagerly: when, at last, the Swedish soldier appears in NWC, cause of I'm a hot fan of the Swedish Military History and glory of the Swedish Arms, and pictures of Gustavus Adolphus and Karl XII's on a wall of my work-room are hanging in one row with pictures of Friedrich the Great and Napoleon.
I'm also a veteran of the Historical Re-enactment and Miniatures Wargaming; and my first the re-enactor uniform was a caftan of the Peter the Great's Ingermanland Infantry Regiment on 1708, and my first miniature armies were the Russians on 1806-07 and Swedes on 1808-09 (then I made all of them for the Great Northern War).

Well, amongst the table-top wargamers the "SKIRMISH" mode of gaming has a lot of fans, there are lots of good special Rules for almost all historical epochs; a cause of the popularity is the mode does not request big outlays of time and resources.
So, my opinion is: the Russo-Swedish Campaign of 1808-09 is a UNIQUE occasion to create that kind of PC wargame for the Napoleonic wars. All engagements of the campaign had implicated comparatively small forces, but ALL ARMS - even guerrillas, fleet and amphibious units, and ALL FORMS of hostilities - regular battles, forest skirmishes, landing operations, fortress siege - the great potentialities for some interesting unusual scenarios!
One bound condition: all scenarios suppose to base on the COMPANY LEVEL of OOBs. Otherwise, there is nothing to do there...

From my side, I would help with designing of elaborate OOBs, including all staffs, AdCs, regimental colours and standards, leaders till Company level etc. and Unit Icons. I have the certain experience and free time for that very painstaking work; moreover, I just love it, and much moreover - my wife already submit it...
I hope... [:D]
Anyway, with our hot interest, knowledge and good info sources - Anton and me - we could help "to move" the theme from deadlock...[8D]


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General-Adjutant Prince Vladimir Repnin
2nd Grenadier Division
8th Corps
2nd Russian Army,
His Imperial Majesty
Chevalier Guards' Chief
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Author:  Bill Peters [ Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:41 am ]
Post subject: 
I am sure that you have alot to offer Vladmir but you and I didn't get along too well last time I got with you (concerning artwork for Jena). Its probably just our chemistry and while I am sure you could do a good job someone else running the team would have to want to work with you.

I am hard to get along with with some folks. I have Paco and others to attest that I can lead a team but some of the guys are longsuffering with me and you and I probably wouldn't be a good mix.

However, this doesn't mean that someone else running the campaign design wouldn't want to have you help out. So keep an open mind on this and if I decide to get a team leader for this project I will let them know to keep you in mind.

Colonel Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)
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