Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)
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Command Knowledge and ability
https://www.wargame.ch/board/nwc/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10453		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  John Corbin [ Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:23 am ]
Post subject:  Command Knowledge and ability
Title is kinda odd but..

Was whatching Zulu last night and it dawned on me that if the 2 lieutenants in command had been killed, the situation would have been far different.

I also wondered what, if any, training was given to Non Commissioned ranks to allow them to command in the event that officers are killed?


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<center>Monsieur le Marechal Baron John Corbin
Commanding L'Armee du Rhin
Grande Duc de Piave et Comte de Beauvais
Commanding the Division de Cavalerie de la Moyenne Garde
NWC President</center>
Author:  Al Amos [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 2:07 am ]
Post subject: 
John,

Good thing the company sgt from Zulu didn't hear that. He tan your hide. The Lts. gave the orders, but they had solid veteran NCO's and others (commisary troops) to listen to.

NCO's drilled the bn regularly, and could run the bn in battle if need be.
Author:  Antony Barlow [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:39 am ]
Post subject: 
I believe the commissary (Dalton?) was a very experienced soldier and played a significant part in planning the defence. I believe Bromhead was partially deaf. Al's right about the senior NCOs though. They would be the ones the ordinary rank and file would look to. The colour sergeant in the film is a good example. I think also that this was an extraordinary situation. A small outnumbered force, surrounded and forced to fight for their lives, with no option to retreat/flee. I can easily imagine a very strong common sense of purpose emerging centred around the NCO's if they could inspire confidence that the cause wasn't hopeless.

An interesting website: http://www.rorkesdriftvc.com/index.html

<center>[url="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/a.r.barlow/nwc/nwc_personal_record.htm"]Brigadier General Antony Barlow[/url]
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/anglo_allied_army_stats/Anglo_Allied_Army_Cavalry_Corps.htm"]2nd British (Union) Brigade, Anglo-Allied Cavalry Corps[/url] ~
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Image</center>
Author:  Ernie Sands [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:55 am ]
Post subject: 
Excellent site, Antony.

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, 1ère Brigade, 19ème Division, VI Corps, L'Armee du Rhin
President, Colonial Campaign Club
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Author:  D.S. Walter [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:12 am ]
Post subject: 
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Antony Barlow</i>
I believe Bromhead was partially deaf.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

He was. He also hadn't been promoted in like 10 years or so. Michael Caine does an excellent job of portraying a picturebook snobby victorian subaltern, but the real Bromhead was likely quite different.

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[url="http://home.arcor.de/dierk_walter/NWC/2nd_Dragoons.htm"]Image[/url]
Maj. Gen. D.S. "Green Horse" Walter
~ 2nd Dragoons (Royal Scots Greys) ~
2nd (Union) Brigade, Anglo-Allied Cavalry Corps
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~ 3rd (Prince of Wales's) Dragoon Guards ~
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Author:  Colin Knox [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:03 am ]
Post subject: 
'Steady men don't shoot until you see the whites of their eyes'.
I love the colour sarg in Zulu.

The movie is also a good representation of how the martini action rifle revolutionised firepower. In a fixed position such as the Drift and obviously without ammo problems the Britz were fearsome despite the magnificient martial nature of the Zulu.

11 vc's I recall.

Both films are excellent I think.





General de Brigade Knox
Baron de l'Empire

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2e Regiment Gardes d'Honneur (the regaled pheasants)
La Jeune Garde

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CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm
Author:  Michael Ellwood [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
Gentlemen,

Now that Hollywood has you under its spell....

For the real story and best understanding I recommend first you read:

"Like Lions they Fought" Robert E Edgerton (1988 GeorgeWiedenfeld & Nicolson Ltd, London).

Then for the definitive accounts:

"How Can Man Die Better" The Secrets of Isandlwana Revealed by Lt Col Mike Snook (RRW) (2005 Greenhill Books, London)

"Like Wolfs on the Fold" The Defence of Rouke's Drift also by Lt Col Mike Snook (RRW) (2005 Greenhill Books, London)

These are very very fine works of research and comprehension of the personalities, politics, events and aftermath of the amazing events of 22/23 January 1879.

Absolutely a must read for all men![:)]



Col Mike Ellwood
Konig Regt
1 Bde, 22 Div
VII Saxon Corps, ADR
Author:  Bill Peters [ Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
The best thing I like about Rourke's Drift .... and Anzio .... both were fought on my birthday! (the troops landed at Anzio on the 22nd)

Ok, kind of partisan but when I noted the dates of both events I became avid fans of both!

The movie premiered in the UK on the 22nd, 1964. I was 3. Remember it well. We had a great birthday here in the states.

Watched Zulu not too long ago after I had purchased and watched Zulu Dawn.

And the movies were British productions I believe with US/Hollywood being the distribution point if I am not mistaken. This from the web:

"The film was made by Diamond Films, Stanley Baker's newly-formed production company, and distributed by Paramount Pictures in all countries except the United States, where it was distributed by Embassy Pictures."

So while it was Paramount Pictures, Baker's hand was in it and its similar in style to many fine British-produced movies (my favorites really).

The movie was based on a book and of course probably had some errors in it. But its the best movie I have ever seen on a man-to-man scale for that period of time. And probably any other period of history.

[:p]

Colonel Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)
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