Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)
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10 minute moves and embedded melee
https://www.wargame.ch/board/nwc/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10589		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Colin Knox [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:09 pm ]
Post subject:  10 minute moves and embedded melee
Hi All
Many of us enjoy playing HPS titles without a large number of house rules and many enjoy playing with some but not many. I fall in the latter category.

This post is aimed at either of the two not those that prefer a bevy of house rules to try and increase historical tactics which is a segment in the club (and fair enough).

I personally find the 10min moves now available in two titles take away the need for many house rules.

For those of you who agree but don't like the blitz effect what is everyones opinion on a simple house rule for 10min moves as follows:

'no artillery battery can be attacked if a non skirmish unit has to be blitzed out of the way to reach it. This does not include the follow up effect of charging cavalry'

We could call it 'the artillery no blitz rule' and it could be negotiated before a game like most optional or house rules.

This would allow Jena and Austerlitz players to proceed at pace in there games and only have to bear in mind this simple rule.

It would make for a nice historical form of play balanced with ease of playability. (I am assuming NME is ticked).

Thoughts?



General de Brigade Knox
Grand Duc d'Austerlitz et Comte de Argentan

Image

Escadron Mamelouks
Chasseurs a'Cheval
Division de Cavalerie la Vieille Garde.

Image



CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm
Author:  Bill Peters [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 3:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
It certainly has some merit. I know the the EM system is popular with many. House rules are unfortunately a necessity in some cases.

Colonel Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)
Image
Author:  Antony Barlow [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 2:31 am ]
Post subject: 
It's an interesting idea Colin but I still prefer to play with embedded melee. It just makes the games a more credible simulation to me and therefore more enjoyable. Just one man's opinion of course.[;)]

<center>[url="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/a.r.barlow/nwc/nwc_personal_record.htm"]Brigadier General Antony Barlow[/url]
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/anglo_allied_army_stats/Anglo_Allied_Army_Cavalry_Corps.htm"]2nd British (Union) Brigade, Anglo-Allied Cavalry Corps[/url] ~
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/militaireacademie/dragoons.html"]4th (Royal Irish) Dragoon Guards[/url] ~
Image</center>
Author:  Colin Knox [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 5:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi Antony
So you would even prefer full embedded melee with the 10 min move as opposed to this proposed rule?

(not 15min where I also prefer full embedded melee)

This rule is a good compromise on the 10 min move Eg it would allow the Jeka's of the world to fight those who don't like blitzs with both players still able to employ their preferred doctrine.

Just thinking out loud really

Regards

General de Brigade Knox
Grand Duc d'Austerlitz et Comte de Argentan

Image

Escadron Mamelouks
Chasseurs a'Cheval
Division de Cavalerie la Vieille Garde.

Image



CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm
Author:  Antony Barlow [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Colin Knox</i>
<br />Hi Antony
So you would even prefer full embedded melee with the 10 min move as opposed to this proposed rule?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Yes, for both 10 and 15 minute turns, for the same reasons. I just don't like the multiple co-ordinated waves of attacks, penetration and surrounding that can occur within a turn and the intricate manoeuvres in the face of the enemy that it enourages. It just does't feel realistic to me and therefore I don't enjoy it. But each to his own[;)]. Having said that though, I DO like to see skirmishers pushed out of the way to allow other units to attack the main battle line within the same turn. I don't think they should be able to block an attack. I'm not for reducing the emphasis on the attack.

<center>[url="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/a.r.barlow/nwc/nwc_personal_record.htm"]Brigadier General Antony Barlow[/url]
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/anglo_allied_army_stats/Anglo_Allied_Army_Cavalry_Corps.htm"]2nd British (Union) Brigade, Anglo-Allied Cavalry Corps[/url] ~
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/militaireacademie/dragoons.html"]4th (Royal Irish) Dragoon Guards[/url] ~
Image</center>
Author:  Kosyanenko [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 3:18 am ]
Post subject: 
Can't say anything until I try it. Sounds interesting. But NME did too. Still it does not substitute the full embedded melee. But taken together they lead to somewhat historical tactics.

BTW my copy of Austerlitz will be under way soon[;)]

<center>Image</center>
<center><b>Eyo Imperatorskogo Velichestva Leib-Kirassirskogo polku
General-Adjutant Anton Valeryevich Kosyanenko
Commander of the Second Army of the West </b></center>
Author:  Jeka [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 4:46 am ]
Post subject: 
Sounds good Colin! Personally I don't like neither embedded melee rule nor NME rule, so for me this is good replacement for both. But I suppose many our members would use it as an addition to above rules.

<hr noshade size="1">
<b>general-feldmarshal prince Eugene Gulyaev-Smolenskiy aka Jeka
Club Secretary
4th Cavalry Corps
Leib-Gvardii Semenovskij Polk</b>
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Author:  Jim Pfleck [ Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:18 am ]
Post subject: 
I like it. I do not use the embedded melee much and I think for the 10 minute turns this is great.
J

Feldmarschall Jim 'Prinz' Pfluecke
Commander, Austrian Cavalry Reserve
3 Graf O'Reilly Chevauxleger Rgt
Hahn Grenadier Bn
Author:  Michael Ellwood [ Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:20 am ]
Post subject: 
Hi guys,

I must say I prefer and agree with what Antony says. The intricate coordination of all arms in those multiple blitz attacks is more of a "game" to me than an historical simultation (however imperfect).

I find the rule where any hex containing less than 100 skirmishers can be melee attacked at ANY time during the move does allow more historical/blitz type options for both sides (obviously with EM in play).

I am also leaning towards restricting units of less than 50 and skm coys of less than 20 as im finding people using them in a manner where they are unrealistically useful. When in reality they should be classed as horse'd'combat, withdrawn or combined) and should be considered next to useless in most situations.

My preference for play :-)

Col Mike Ellwood
Konig Regt
1 Bde, 22 Div
VII Saxon Corps, ADR
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