Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)
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Call to Arms - MOE IV/ RULES anyone?
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Author:  Michael Ellwood [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:55 am ]
Post subject:  Call to Arms - MOE IV/ RULES anyone?
Sir Muddy and Gentelmen,

Thought I might generate some ideas on the tournament table and a discussion on any required update of the MOE IV Rules.

As we have so many players and the Tourney seems popular I offer a couple of other ideas:

1. Have two running side by side being a veterans and virgins league with the winner of each playing off for the title. The veterans would be all that have played before (or possibly over a certain rank/experience level?) and the virgins all those that have not (or are "junior" memebers).

2. Have a Major League and a Minor League where we all play the first round and the winners go into the major league and the losers into the minor league and continue two touneys again side by side with the winners getting to play-off for the title. That way those that are up against an veteran/old hand first up have a chance to continue.

Just a thought as the tourney seems so popular it would be a shame to see so many only play one or two games and the veterans take the lions share (although I'm sure Colin will dispute that ).

Now onto updating the MOE IV Rules. Having played/playing several Jena games recently I find the MOE III rules are great but would like to raise two issues I think could be changed/added:

1. The requirment to conduct embedded melee against a hex containing 100+ skirmishers AND infanrty units (Battalions) of under 100 I think should be changed to - Any <u><b>CLEAR HEX</b></u> containing only skirmish coys or a unit of less than 100 can be melee attacked at any stage, as long as the attacking force is in good order and has a combined minimum total of four to one (4:1) advantage if infantry and three to one (3:1) if cavalry.
This would stop the skirmish screen being so effective when in reality if in the <u><b>OPEN</b></u> they fell back against good order troops. It also stops the small "remnants" of units holding up larger forces in the <u><b>OPEN</b></u> when in reality they should be classed as 'hors d combat'. Yes there is always the exception to the rule but even the glorious 14th Ligne at Eylau was overrun!

2. Cavalry defending in woods are imperveous to anything but fire and so are ideal to hold up advancing forces when in reality they would be swamped by infantry at close range and would have retreated in order to get out of there. Therefore I believe Cavalry confronted in a wood/orchard/rough hex, by infantry of equal or greater numbers, must withdraw from that terrain type at best speed.

So those are just my thoughts and what is the general conscensous reference the rules? Any other ideas/suggestions now would be a good time to get it out of the way. [:)]

Regards to all.




Col Mike Ellwood
Konig Regt
1 Bde, 22 Div
VII Saxon Corps, ADR
Author:  dean beecham [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:09 am ]
Post subject: 
Hi Mike.

A League sounds good fun.. but its all up to Sir Muddy ,

With the Rules.. I can not see Jena being used, as some of the Guys dont have it .. But what you have down about Cav holding Wood hexes.. Yes that should be changed ..

I am with you there ..

<font color="red">Maréchal</font id="red">
<font color="red">BEECHAM</font id="red">
<font color="blue">La</font id="blue"> Commandeur, <font color="red">II Corps</font id="red">
<font color="blue">A</font id="blue">D<font color="red">N</font id="red">

Prince d` Istria et Comte d` Arles La Jeune Garde

"Toujours féroce,jamais étourdi"
Author:  Colin Knox [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi Mike and Dean

My 5 cents;

In a competitive tournament where you are likely to play people of very diverse views on history I think the lowest number of house rules the better. So I would not be in favour of adding more.
Basically less chance of arguments due to less subjectivity.

Although I actually agree with your suggestion Mike (from a historical perspective) I for one would just like to see the same rules as the last tourney. Just my opinion [:D][:)]

But at the end of the day Muddy is going to go to the trouble of organising it so he will no doubt set the rules. Or perhaps his horse will have a say in it [:D]

Salute!

General de Brigade Knox
Baron de l'Empire
2e Regiment Gardes d'Honneur (the regaled pheasants)
La Jeune Garde
CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm

Image
Author:  Yann Lamezec [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
Dear all

I agree with Colin. Personally, I dislike houses rules and the lowest number of house rules the better. So I would not be in favour of adding more. I consider it's a tournament not an historical reconstitution. Neverthless I respect, of course, the point of view of those who want to play historical. May be they can build an historical tournament with a hundred of houses rules [:D]

More, this tournament is organize by Sir Muddy. I suppose (I am sure) that he has a definitive idea of the rules as well of the general organization of the tournament.

So messieurs, stop speaking, the time to fight arrives !
Que le meilleur gagne !

Best regards

Marechal Lamezec
Prince et Comte de Davout
French CIC
Author:  Antony Barlow [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
Basically the minimum rules that I feel the games need (just my opinion of course[;)]) is a simple embedded melee rule, with melee against skirmisher units of ANY size being the exception to the rule. But I agree with those who say it's wise to keep things as simple as possible for a tournament situation.

<center>[url="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/a.r.barlow/Napoleonic/nap.htm"]Brigadier General Antony Barlow[/url]
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/anglo_allied_army_stats/Anglo_Allied_Army_Cavalry_Corps.htm"]2nd British (Union) Brigade, Anglo-Allied Cavalry Corps[/url] ~
~ [url="http://www.geocities.com/militaireacademie/dragoons.html"]4th (Royal Irish) Dragoon Guards[/url] ~
Image</center>
Author:  Tomate_Frit [ Sun Sep 21, 2008 10:30 am ]
Post subject: 
I too prefer Tourney game with the least amount of rules, but do enjoy playing by the embedded melee rules.

I very much agree with Anthony; a simple embedded melee rule, with melee against skirmisher units of ANY size being the exception to the rule.

I like the cavalry idea too !




Maréchal John Mitchell
Grande Duc de Rivoli et Comte de Bordeaux
Commandant Division Infanterie; La Veille Garde
105e Regiment d' Infantrie Ligne,
2e Brigade, 1er Division Infanterie,
I Corp, AdN
Author:  Jeka [ Sun Sep 21, 2008 10:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
Do we really need the embedded melee rule? This rule was added to prevent blitzkrieg, when hundreds of men get surrounded and then eliminated from the field with just on melee.
In my opinion with new No melee elimination option we do not need embedded melee rule anymore.

<b>general-feldmarshal count Eugene Gulyaev
Club Secretary
RA Chief of Staff
Leib-Gvardii Semenovskij Polk
</b>
Image
Author:  dean beecham [ Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:45 am ]
Post subject: 
Jeka

Apart from Jena . as the movement is a lot slower .. Large ZOC can still be done .. in the other 3 games .

So yes i think the EMR should still be used .

<font color="red">Maréchal</font id="red">
<font color="red">BEECHAM</font id="red">
<font color="blue">La</font id="blue"> Commandeur, <font color="red">II Corps</font id="red">
<font color="blue">A</font id="blue">D<font color="red">N</font id="red">

Prince d` Istria et Comte d` Arles La Jeune Garde

"Toujours féroce,jamais étourdi"
Author:  Colin Knox [ Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi All
I for one won't play if we don't have embedded melee. I just find it more like a panzer battle than Napoleonic warfare without it. Jeka you did a good job training me in it though [:D][:D].

I don't play embedded in Jena though as the engine is far better for a range of reasons - stacking, movement rates, unit sizes and firepower generally.

Anyway I am sure Muddy will decide as tourney organiser. He who does the work sets the rules [:D]

regards
Colin Knox


General de Brigade Knox
Baron de l'Empire
2e Regiment Gardes d'Honneur (the regaled pheasants)
La Jeune Garde
CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm

Image
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