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 Post subject: Long Battle vs Short Battle
PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 4:45 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 22, 2001 8:03 pm
Posts: 2243
Location: USA
This is gonna hurt because I like to play the full battles instead of the short scenarios, but what the hey, it won't be the first time that I've inflicted pain upon myself.

If I complete 200 turns with a Major Victory then I get 57 OBD points for my victory.

If I complete 100 turns with a Major Victory then I get 29 OBD points for my victory, so two of those (200 turns) would get me 58 OBD points (1 point differential ain't bad).

If I complete 50 turns with a Major Victory then I get 15 OBD points for my victory, so four of those (200 turns) would get me 60 OBD points (3 point differential requires some effort but I can justify it to myself).

If I complete 25 turns with a Major Victory then I get 8 OBD points for my victory, so eight of those (200 turns) would get me 64 OBD points (7 point differential is starting to wear a bit on my nerves and temperament).

If I complete 10 turns with a Major Victory then I get 3.8 OBD points for my victory, so twenty of those (200 turns) would get me 76 OBD points (19 point differential is about the biggest pile of cow manure that I've seen since I left Texas).

So if I do the 200 turn battle, then I get 57 points and my record is 1-0 which ain't gonna win any medals in any army that I know of. But if I do twenty 10 turn battles, then I get 76 points (vs 57 points) and my record is 10-0 (vs 1-0) which is gonna shower me with praise, chest glitter, and probably some more points for having the best record in the Army.

No, I didn't figure it based upon suffering Major Defeats in those battles because ... because ... well, I didn't want to. And just for the record, yes, I'll still prefer the full battles because it ain't all about points.


Lt Gen Ned Simms
VI/AoS/USA
Blood 'n Guts hisself, a land lovin' pirate. Show me some arty tubes and we'll charge 'em.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:29 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2001 12:37 pm
Posts: 356
Location: USA
Ned
How many times have we heard-"its not about points". The club is NOT a ladder club and points are NOT important. Yet

Points determine rank
rank determines club positions and sometime prestiege.

How about a 200 turn victory for 29 points-thats what you get for defeating someone in the same Army- but hey its not about points.yet

Points determine rank
rank determine club positions and sometimes prestiege.

If one does for some reason desire points for ( rank, position)than your opponent pool is effectively cut in half. This is a big agenda for many very influential players( to maintain Army integrity)but for most it just means ad after ad asking for Yank opponents.( why I dont know).

When I was a Yank my closest friends in the club were all Rebs!! Thats who I played and who I got to know. In order to meet more Yanks I switched sides. Then I did indeed buy into "its not about points" and just played whoever but the main factor is- its mostly Yanks versus Rebs as some influential players want but I maintain-a voice in the darkness- that Army integrity can be maintained through other means and let the points be the same against reb or Yank!!

Sorry for the rant folks
[:I][:o)]

Colonel Tony Best
Army of Georgia


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:10 am 
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Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 5:41 am
Posts: 873
Location: Somewhere between D.C. and the battlefield
Long scenarios on big maps are most fun. I play them almost exclusively these times, thank HPS for that. Of course that means I haven't completed a battle since February 2006 in spite of playing every day, but what the hell.

Gen. Walter, USA
<i>The Blue Blitz</i>
3/2/VIII AoS
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:53 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2001 2:39 am
Posts: 285
Location: USA
This is why I like to play the campaigns, You can get a mix of smaller and larger battles as you progress through the campaign in most of the titles. I don't think I've played any single battles except for tourneys since I gave up the BG titles two years ago..

Lt. Gen. Ed Blackburn
II/VI/AoS
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"Forward Bucktails"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:24 am 
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Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 2:56 pm
Posts: 112
Location: USA, New Jersey, Ocean County
I'm not voting one way or the other on longer vs smaller scenarios, just some observations about the "analysis".

If you play a lot of smaller scenarios you are likley to have a mix of results. I suspect even the best players don't win more then about 70% of their games. So you need to consider that in totaling up the points possibilities.

My experience is that the long scenarios involve a lot of marching, while the shorter games have a higher percentage of turns related to combat. So you need to consider whether you are earning the points for "marching" or "fighting". I recognize that "marching" can be a strategy for victory, but I think it is less "effort", once you commit to the strategy.

Playing shorter scenarios probably means you are interacting with more opponents, and hence rewarded for developing a broader-based reputation among the opposition.

...and now for the "what I'd like to see" comment. I think it is possible to use the campaign engine to create a "campaign" version of a battle. Rather then playing one monster game, the battle gets segmented into a number of smaller engagements -- perhaps no longer then 60-90 minutes and with no more then a couple of Divisions of troops engaged. The "strategic choices" at the beginning of each engagement determines the flow of battle over the field of play. The downside is that I think the matrix of choices and the number of scenarios can get very big so you would need a creative structure for this, but I think if you were interested in focusing on one battle, it would be an interesting way to explore the "what ifs", and each play of the "battle" would likely be different.

Lt Gen Bob Breen
Commanding XIX Corps, AoS
"Defenders of the Right"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:48 am 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2001 11:25 am
Posts: 777
Location: USA
General Simms,

Thank you for the analysis. I've always prefered longer battles over shorter ones (which is why it took me YEARS to reach my current rank -- and most of the necessary OBD points came from club Administration [:)] !)

I see the longer scenarios as focusing on strategy and the shorter ones on tactics. Six-to-twelve turn scenarios offer zero opportunity for maneuver, but they are excellent for learning the basics of combat. A person can lose several of these shorter scenarios -- learning basic tactics along the way -- with much less disillusionment than after maneuvering for almost eight weeks of almost daily file turn-around THEN getting kicked in the seat at first contact by someone who had a better grasp of game mechanics [V] !

As a VMI instructor (with a rank of Colonel, by the way), I would explain these differences to my cadets and point out that if they were interested in rapid promotion they may want to concentrate on shorter scenarios early on. Ian Russell was one of my cadets who took my instruction to heart -- he became a Lieutenant General I think before I ever made Brigadier [^] !


Your humble servant,
Gen 'Dee Dubya' Mallory

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David W. Mallory
ACW - General, 3/2/I/AotM (Club President & Cabinet Member)
CCC - Lieutenant, Georgia Volunteers, Southern Regional Department, Colonial American Army


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:50 am 
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Location: USA
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by bobbreen</i>
<br />...and now for the "what I'd like to see" comment. I think it is possible to use the campaign engine to create a "campaign" version of a battle. Rather then playing one monster game, the battle gets segmented into a number of smaller engagements -- perhaps no longer then 60-90 minutes and with no more then a couple of Divisions of troops engaged. The "strategic choices" at the beginning of each engagement determines the flow of battle over the field of play. The downside is that I think the matrix of choices and the number of scenarios can get very big so you would need a creative structure for this, but I think if you were interested in focusing on one battle, it would be an interesting way to explore the "what ifs", and each play of the "battle" would likely be different.

Lt Gen Bob Breen
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

General Breen,

I agree wholeheartedly, and I can't think of anyone better suited to setting up such a campaign than yourself.

If you decide to take on this task, please keep me in mind as a play-tester!


Your humble servant,
Gen 'Dee Dubya' Mallory

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David W. Mallory
ACW - General, 3/2/I/AotM (Club President & Cabinet Member)
CCC - Lieutenant, Georgia Volunteers, Southern Regional Department, Colonial American Army


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 12:01 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 3:35 pm
Posts: 192
Location: USA
<font color="yellow">Gen Simms,

All I have to say is...that was about the funniest post I've read in a long time.[:D]

Thanks for the humor.[:)]

Regards,</font id="yellow">

<font color="yellow">Col. Boyd Denner
"Alabama Brigade"
1/3/III
ANV
"God Bless the Alabamians" Gen. Robert E. Lee - The Wilderness 1864</font id="yellow">


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:24 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2001 2:39 am
Posts: 285
Location: USA
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Boyd</i>
<br /><font color="yellow">Gen Simms,

All I have to say is...that was about the funniest post I've read in a long time.[:D]

Thanks for the humor.[:)]

Regards,</font id="yellow">

<font color="yellow">Col. Boyd Denner
"Alabama Brigade"
1/3/III
ANV
"God Bless the Alabamians" Gen. Robert E. Lee - The Wilderness 1864</font id="yellow">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Col. Denner,

You can find Gen. Simms on the Comedy Channel, Thursdays at 9:00Pm.[:o)]

Lt. Gen. Ed Blackburn
II/VI/AoS
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"Forward Bucktails"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:19 am 
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Location: USA
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Boyd</i>
<br />All I have to say is...that was about the funniest post I've read in a long time.[:D]

Thanks for the humor.[:)]

Col. Boyd Denner
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Col. Denner,

You think <i>THAT </i>was funny? Don't get General Simms started. When he really lets loose I find myself rolling on the floor [:D] !

He told a tale last year about his wife standing in the creek holding up the telegraph wire for him so he could continue to play his games . . . (I have omitted the myriad details, but it was a good story!)


Your humble servant,
Gen 'Dee Dubya' Mallory

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David W. Mallory
ACW - General, 3/2/I/AotM (Club President & Cabinet Member)
CCC - Lieutenant, Georgia Volunteers, Southern Regional Department, Colonial American Army


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:48 am 
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Joined: Tue May 22, 2001 4:51 pm
Posts: 2809
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Hmmmm, I thought Gen Simms was serious![:o)]

I had my calculator out and was checking the figures.

I concluded that I AM NOT THE FATHER of ANNA Nicole Smith's daughter.[:p]

<b><font color="gold">Ernie Sands
General, Commanding, Army of Ohio
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ACWGC Cabinet member
</b></font id="gold">


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 11:50 am 
Now let me think about this, 5 years is some time ago, but if my records serve me right, Arrrrrr yes he we are, OK

It is true I did receive that information from our illustrious leader and my VMI instructor Gen D.W Mallory. However in my defence I would just like to clarify one or two things.

I had played 15 games before I played one of 10 turns, the next least was 18 turns, and there were 9 games between 20 and 50, the other 4 were battles of 51, 90, 90 and 149. 7 Major Victory’s, 1 Minor Victory, 1 draw, 1 Minor defeat and 4 Major Defeats, with one abandoned.

5 games were against Generals, 6 L/Colonels 3 Majors, 1 Fd/Lt.

In those early days I could have up to 9 battles going at the same time, my promotion was quick, of that there is no doubt, but it was through playing a large number of games, being extremely active within the forums and as a result acquiring a significant number of admin points (Most of which were given to me by Ned Simms and Bill Peters!!). I accepted command positions very early and progressed through the positions until I reached first the VMI and then a Theatre Command.

For me it was never about points, however I did enjoy receiving Promotions, Medals (such as they were) and higher and higher command positions. The points came as a result of my love for the game, the game did not come as a result of my love for points!!!

As a cautionary word, I am not as active as I once was, I fear I over did things and could not keep up with my own demanding pace.

I also feel the joy as gone out of the club, the forums are not visited as they once were, the banter, tales of battle, humorous story, the role play, respecting and using peoples rank in correspondence, these are all missing.
Ned your tales of life down by the creek, the stories of the visitors you had and the close shaves with your good lady, all while drinking your famous gut rot liquor these were things of legend.
Sadly it all seems to have ground to a halt.

Anyway having said my piece, I shall, pick up my fishing rod and go back to the old creek, I still find flagons of Liquor from time to time, I think they are the ones Ned’s good lady threw at him and he was able to duck, it’s the best darn medicine for my mules loose bowels I have ever come across, don’t know what I will do once I stop pulling them out, guess I will have to find a good cork supplier.


Gen Ian Rousell
"England's Pride"
VI/III/II - AoG


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