Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)

Gents,
Please welcome Fähnrich Chris Perleberg. Some of you may know him from the Civil War club and he is an eager modder.

So welcome Chris and good luck against the French hordes.

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And, I believe it should be Sekondleutnant Perleberg...

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welcome aboard

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C.N.Matthews

Indeed welcome!

Herzlich willkommen Herr Sekondleutnant Perleberg!

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Welcome to the club!

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Welcome to the club.

I have to ask though ... isn't Sekund referring to a unit of time, and not the number 2 (2nd)... that would have to be based on the German word for 2 ... Zwei (as in zweite. zweiten, etc ... not looking up the definite article for the exact ending.).

Just don't call it Zwitterleutnant ... I think that means something else entirely (sorry -Rammstein fan hier...).

Actually I doubt the Germans -well Prussians technically ever used a numerical designation... but that is a different thing.

Anyway ... Greets, sir- cya out on the field sometime, I am sure.

Interesting question. I am sure the Prussians took the name from elsewhere. You'd say they took it from the French, since that language was very fashionable in the 18th century. However, the French seem to have used sous-lieutenant. So my guess is that they took it from the English. Nowadays in German it is Leutnant and Oberleutnant.

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Nah, actually what I was saying was that I think someone who came up with the ranks in the club whenever that happened was probably using something like Babelfish with predictable results ...

It probably had to do with trying to create some sort of equivalent structure across sides within the club, and if I had to guess it was probably that having one side call the equivalent of 2nd Lieutenant called a Leutnant would maybe be confusing. If that was the case it might be better to go with Unterleutnant as granted, technically, a made up rank -but at least more consistent with German language (well in my opinion) --who knows, maybe I am wrong about that all. . . and really I hope I am.

If so, it would not be the first time.

Well taking a look at the Prussian ranks there isn't much resemblance:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Prus ... ssian_Army
But wiki isn't so trustful so a better source should be found.
Especially since with the changes in the Prussian Army in 1808 there were also changes to the rank structure.

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Sekondleutnant is the correct term for the Napoleonic era. This is from the official Prussian "secret" archives:

Lebensdaten des Hermann Erdmann Konstantin Graf von Pückler
Freiherr von Groditz

24.12.1797 Geburt in Hohlstein (Kr. Löwenberg)
Bruder der Generäle Friedrich Wilhelm und Wilhelm Erdmann
20.5.1811 Kadett zu Berlin
21.4.1815 Sekondleutnant im 2. Garderegiment zu Fuß
1815 Marsch nach Paris
23.4.1822 Premierleutnant

http://archivdatenbank.gsta.spk-berlin.de/midosasearch-gsta/MidosaSEARCH/bph_rep_192_nl_pueckler_h_v/index.htm?kid=2b0bc6e9-5f72-40ad-a500-8f8af00d5d48

Your wiki link has some incorrect ranks, it should be Fähnrich and Premierleutnant.

Yep what I feared, just not reliable in details.
Anyhow does anyone know a source that goes in detail with the Prussian ranks?

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The ranks have had some small adjustments over the years. Not sure what the original source used was. But they have been generally unchanged.....

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Generalfeldmarschall Scott Kronprinz "Vorwärts" Ludwig von Preußen
Kommandeur des Königlich-Preußischen Armee-Korps
Chief of Staff (CoS) of the Allied Coalition
Allied Coalition Webmaster & Club Website Support

Welcome Chris!!

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Generalfeldmarschall Scott Kronprinz "Vorwärts" Ludwig von Preußen
Kommandeur des Königlich-Preußischen Armee-Korps
Chief of Staff (CoS) of the Allied Coalition
Allied Coalition Webmaster & Club Website Support

Welcome Sir. I hope you have fun.

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Général Gregor Morgan
Duc de Montebello et Comte de Gironde
Chef d'État-Major de la Grande Armée
Commandant du 1er Corps d'Armée