Napoleonic Wargame Club (NWC)

The Rhine Tavern

*   NWC   NWC Staff   NWC Rules   NWC (DoR) Records   About Us   Send Email Inquiry to NWC

*   La Grande Armée Quartier Général    La Grande Armée Officer Records    Join La Grande Armée

*   Allied Coalition   Allied Officers   Join Coalition

*   Coalition Armies:   Austro-Prussian-Swedish Army   Anglo Allied Army (AAA)   Imperial Russian Army

 

Forums:    ACWGC    CCC     Home:    ACWGC    CCC
It is currently Tue May 06, 2025 2:27 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Movement Format Poll
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 3:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 10:18 am
Posts: 6156
Rich and I have discussed the different movement rates that each of the games in the series offers. Currently we have:

1. Eckmuhl/Wagram - this uses the traditional movement values.
Pros - faster games - less files

Cons - blitz moves can overwhelm a side unless NME is turned ON - even then the cavalry charges along with followup movement can overwhelm a player's formations.

2. NRC/Wateroo - the movement rate was reduced slightly. Turn length is the same.

Pros - cut down on blitz moves somewhat. You still can overwhelm a players side if done properly but with reduced charge followup the amount was reduced somewhat as to the amount of damage you can wreck.

Cons - you can still move down a road and get into the rear of units almost on par with the traditional approach if done right.

3. Jena - 10 minute moves - fractional movement is similar to the traditional approach.

Pros - cut way back on the blitz moves you could do as a player can react to his opponents approach.

Cons - more game files to do - a typical 12 hour battle for the traditional/NRC/Waterloo game is 48 turns while this new approach is game is now 72 game turns. Here is a chart showing the various hours for reference (numbers are hours - game turns Traditional/Jena)
12 - 48/72
10 - 40/60
8 - 32/48
6 - 24/36
4 - 16/24

Now the poll.

1. Which format do you prefer?

a. Traditional
b. NRC/Waterloo
c. Jena

2. For future games: should we use:

a. Traditional
b. NRC/Waterloo
c. Jena
d. b&c - have two sets of scenarios - one for the guys that like the slower Jena design approach and one for the guys that like the NRC/Waterloo design approach.

3. For Eckmuhl and Wagram: which way should I go? (none of the below options would impact current games)

a. Leave it alone. You continue to fight any new battles you start up using the Traditional PDT file format.

b. Add in a set of PDT files that the guys can use for the NRC or Jena approach. The players would then be able to create new sets of scenarios based on these PDT files. I would create two PDT files and you guys could make copies of the scenarios and then just change the PDT file line and for the Jena type PDT file format you would probably want to modify the reinforcement arrival times from the 10, 20, 40, 50 format to 0, 15, 30 or 45 mins.

c. Do a full set of scenarios (as seen in the main folder/scenario selection dialog) to include a new PDT file using NRC/Waterloo. In other words you get a completely NEW set of scenarios that use the NRC/Waterloo PDT file format.

d. As per "C" but use Jena's format. A second set of scenarios that would play just like Jena.

e. Change the existing set of scenarios to use NRC/Waterloo format. New games you start up would use the new PDT file. You would no longer use the Traditional format. No other PDT files would be created for the game.

f. As per "E" but use the Jena format.

Note in #3 I would not modify in any way the campaign scenarios. There are over 130 of them and I just dont have time to do that right now. Perhaps for a future project or if someone wants to help me out ... I could put out a new set of Five Days in April campaign files as there are fewer of them than for the long campaign.

Rich and I have discussed the older EC/WC games. Newer rules have helped keep the blitz ability in check somewhat. I just hate seeing 3 different sets of values. Rich is the head guy in the group but has seen fit to give me some freedom of design. However, I really dont want to have 3 sets of movement values as a norm. For my future titles I am going to offer BOTH the Jena and NRC formats but I do want to hear from you guys that like the Traditional (EC/WC) movement rates.

So what say ye?

Capt. Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)

[url="http://www.fireandmelee.net"]Fire and Melee Wargame site[/url]

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 3:27 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 9:01 am
Posts: 1411
Location: USA
1. c
2. c
3. f

Major General Ed Blackburn
Commanding Second Div, II Corps, AAA
3rd Bn / 1st Regiment of Foot Guards
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2001 8:49 am
Posts: 1072
Location: USA
1.c
2.c
3.I guess f but d would be fine, not sure ont he difference

I really like the Jena movement rates. For me, it is not the number of turns for a battle but the number of pieces to move that gets me. I can handle another 20 file exchanges over the course of a big battle but I choose what games to play based on how long each move takes, rather than by how many moves there are..

Feldmarschall Jim 'Prinz' Pfluecke
Commander, Austrian Cavalry Reserve
3 Graf O'Reilly Chevauxleger Rgt
Hahn Grenadier Bn


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 10:18 am
Posts: 6156
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="3" face="book antiqua" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jim Pfleck</i>
<br />1.c
2.c
3.I guess f but d would be fine, not sure ont he difference

I really like the Jena movement rates. For me, it is not the number of turns for a battle but the number of pieces to move that gets me. I can handle another 20 file exchanges over the course of a big battle but I choose what games to play based on how long each move takes, rather than by how many moves there are..

Feldmarschall Jim 'Prinz' Pfluecke
Commander, Austrian Cavalry Reserve
3 Graf O'Reilly Chevauxleger Rgt
Hahn Grenadier Bn



<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Jim - the difference in the two options for #3 is option "D" has me making up a SECOND set of scenarios. Thus you can play the traditional way OR the Jena way. Option "F" is for me to change the CURRENT set of scenarios to use Jena's format. Probably NOT the way I want to go ... but I just wanted to see if the new format was that much better.

And option E would use the NRC/Waterloo format for all new battles you would fight. No other format would be played for the game.

Capt. Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)

[url="http://www.fireandmelee.net"]Fire and Melee Wargame site[/url]

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:42 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 10:18 am
Posts: 6156
One comment I want to make on this: I prefer my new PDT file format for the Pike/Road MP cost differences. Even if I did change the PDT files for the games I would create a fractionalized format such that NRC rates would be doubled and the terrain costs adjusted accordingly but in such a way for Pike and Road that you would get the same effect as you get in EC/WC/Jena. I really feel that a Pike should give you a better move rate than a Road. Otherwise why the two road types?

Capt. Bill Peters
Armee du Rhin - V Corps, Cavalerie du V Corps, 20ème légère Brigade de Cavalerie, 13ème Hussar Regiment
HPS Napoleonic Scenario Designer (Eckmuhl, Wagram, Jena-Auerstaedt and ... more to come)

[url="http://www.fireandmelee.net"]Fire and Melee Wargame site[/url]

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 6:09 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 10:57 am
Posts: 2197
Location: Canada
1 c
2 c
3 f

The slower move rates and 10 min turns of Jena took a while to get used to but now I love it

<center>Image
</center>
<center>Image
[img]</center>
<center>Monsieur le Marechal Baron John Corbin
Commanding L'Armee du Rhin
Grande Duc de Piave et Comte de Beauvais
Commanding the Division de Cavalerie de la Moyenne Garde
NWC President</center>


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 9:37 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 4:11 pm
Posts: 1765
Location: New Zealand
Hi Bill
My vote is the same as John's it's Jena alround!

1 c
2 c
3 f

I agree with Jim's comments too. Only thing I would add is the fire values from Jena seem the best as well so hopefully you mean the full PDT. NRC has a lot of emphasis on melee I believe.

Can't wait for the new titles![:D]

Regards

Colonel Colin Knox,
Baron de l'Empire
2e Regiment Gardes d'Honneur
La Jeune Garde
CO. 1er Brigade, III Division Cavalerie Legere, III Corps Armee du Nord
http://www.aspire.co.nz/colinknoxnwc.htm

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 12:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 10:30 am
Posts: 88
Location: Poland
Bill,
I vote definitely for Jena!

1. c
2. c
3. f

Is there any chance to improve Waterloo and NRC as well?


<center>Maréchal T. Nowacki
<b>V KORPUS ARMII RENU</b>
Image
Comte de Liege
Duc de la Moskova
Image
Chasseurs a Cheval de la Vieille Garde</center>


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 1:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2002 9:44 am
Posts: 476
Location: Ireland
Jena.

2c
3 Jena format.

To me Jena is the best playing game , The format out dos the rest.

<font color="red">Maréchal</font id="red">
<font color="red">BEECHAM</font id="red"> Commandant 1ème Division de Cuirassiers,
1 Corps Res Cav,ADN.

Prince d` Istria et Comte d` Arles La Jeune Garde

"Toujours féroce,jamais étourdi"


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
POWERED_BY
Localized by Maël Soucaze © 2010 phpBB.fr